CSIS

[Croghan27]

Slime, slime, slime, cover up

Fadden's testimony before committee today.

Via Blast Furnace

If I had to guess who he is ... I would say Bill Haydon.  The fourth person in the quartet of Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, ____.

[skdadl]

CSIS has so many Bills, though, Croggy. I thought that Jim Judd was a Haydon too.

Was there ever a Smiley? Or a Guillam? I'd settle even for a Toby.

[Croghan27]

CSIS has so many Bills, though, Croggy. I thought that Jim Judd was a Haydon too.

Was there ever a Smiley? Or a Guillam? I'd settle even for a Toby.

Esterhase - that miserable little obsequious Czech? I have worked with a dozen Tobys - they will survive under any regimen. I am sure CSIS has a dozen of them.

Guillam was an impressive man, one time head of the 'scalphunters' (the violent agency of the Circus) - injured in some unexplained way, probably in Call for the Dead,  - then farmed out (by Bill) to teach in a 2nd 3rd rate public (private) school.

He is best described by an offhand remark by Smiley when talking to the managers of the school. They note a large gap in his QV and Smiley observes: "I remember there was something of a war going on about then."

His big quote, to one of the more shy students at the school: "Name's Bill is it? Known a lot of Bills in my time. All of them good'ens."

and the rest is the unfolding of that statement. His fault was loyalty - he loved too well and not wisely.

[skdadl]

Guillam was an impressive man, one time head of the 'scalphunters' (the violent agency of the Circus) - injured in some unexplained way, probably in Call for the Dead,  - then farmed out (by Bill) to teach in a 2nd 3rd rate public (private) school.

Croggy, you're conflating two characters here, young Guillam (Peter Guillam) and Jim Prideaux. Jim was close to Haydon, was caught and badly wounded in an operation that went wrong in Czecho, comes home a broken man (presumably after torture as well), and is farmed out by the Circus to that public school.

Guillam was close to Smiley, mentored by him, so when the Czech operation failed and Control died soon after and as clouds of suspicion swirled around, Smiley was edged out and everyone close to him, like Guillam, was demoted -- young Peter was sent to run the scalphunter operations safely away from the Circus, from a base in south London. It is Guillam that the government turn to as a liaison with a retired Smiley to get him involved in the investigation of the mole at the Circus.

Guillam does become Jim's successor, but Guillam is young and sexy, and Jim is older and very righteously angry, the avenging angel who gets the last word about the mole who betrayed him.

[Croghan27]

Guillam was close to Smiley, mentored by him, so when the Czech operation failed and Control died soon after and as clouds of suspicion swirled around, Smiley was edged out and everyone close to him, like Guillam, was demoted -- young Peter was sent to run the scalphunter operations safely away from the Circus, from a base in south London. It is Guillam that the government turn to as a liaison with a retired Smiley to get him involved in the investigation of the mole at the Circus.

Guillam does become Jim's successor, but Guillam is young and sexy, and Jim is older and very righteously angry, the avenging angel who gets the last word about the mole who betrayed him.

Guillam morphs under the hand of le Carre - you are correct (as per usual  ) about my confusion between Jim and Peter - it is Peter who swipes the "Testify" file from the Circus for Smiley. The file shows that the expedition into Czechoslovakia was ended, not by Czech troops, but by Russian - there in lies the connection to Karla.

The botched intrusion into Czecho was in "The Looking Glass War" (and the first book I read by le Carre). But it he is a Pole then. (The movie sucks.)

Haydon manages to have his neck broken by his old compatriot, Jim Prideau, to finish the Karla saga.

I doubt if anyone in the CSIS building in Ottawa would dare break anyone's neck unless they got permission from Langley. 

[skdadl]

... it is Peter who swipes the "Testify" file from the Circus for Smiley. The file shows that the expedition into Czechoslovakia was ended, not by Czech troops, but by Russian - there in lies the connection to Karla.

My very favouritest line in Tinker Tailor happens when Guillam runs into Haydon on one of his two runs into the Circus to look at files in the library (there are two; I forget which one this is). We don't know at that point that Haydon is the villain. Haydon, though, knows that Guillam is both smart and one of George's loyal peeps. In the great TV film version, Ian Richardson as Haydon looks young Peter (Michael Jayston) up and down and says to the security officer, "Young Peter Guillam, eh? Count the spoons."

I love the novel, absolutely loved the TV series. I don't know when I've seen better acting. Guinness and Richardson playing off each other with such material -- they must have had such a good time.

[Croghan27]

That ends the whole Karla episodes - begun with searching for a legend for a Russian lady in Paris, it ends with Smiley picking up the cigarette lighter discarded by Karla (a gift to GS from 'the delicious Ann') as he (Karla) slowly walks across the bridge to Check Point Charlie.

Enjoy it as I did .... I had the cassettes of le Carre himself reading the books and would play them as I drove to Edmonton from Fort McMurray, I think that the subsequent book: The Perfect Spy is even better. The knock being it is not as long.)

Given we are talking about a world of spooks and shadows I wonder why would this Richard Fadden, the head honcho, go ahead and make his political masters look like dumbfucks. (Not that they arn't - but it have it exposed so blatantly is probably a major faux pas on his part.)

Maybe it is too much le Carre - but I keep seeing wheels within wheels.  These gyus are doubly circumspect - making diplomats look like blabbermouths. I am not sure about here, but I believe in Britain it is illegal to even name the head of MI5/6.

Is he pissed at Toews? Harper? the entire government? Is there a personal pr professional agenda. More important than who the politicians 'influenced by a foreign government' are, or what government(s) he is speaking about is why is he going public, public now.

With him going so public, and apparently he will name names 'to the government' - it gives those people time to clean their stables before anything official is done.

Check the shredding machines and you will find the parties.
 

[skdadl]

That's the end of Smiley's People, Karla's defection. Tinker Tailor ends with Haydon's unmasking and Jim's revenge.
 
I like A Perfect Spy too, and there was a fine TV film made of that, but I miss Smiley when the books aren't about him. Poor Le Carre created something that finally took him over -- he dedicated one later Smiley book to Alec Guinness because, he said, he couldn't imagine his own character as anyone but Guinness any longer. Me either.
 
I don't know what Fadden was doing. I think it's possible that he has such an inflated sense of himself (Judd did) that he didn't realize people would react to what he said. I think it's possible that there is actually not all that much serious going on here -- in the sense that the Chinese are actually up to anything more nefarious than usual. But I think that Fadden shares a political ideology with his masters and wouldn't mind hurting a few Canadian politicians -- that was part of the point. The other part was probably to puff up the reputation of CSIS because they want more money. He just didn't grasp that people would dare to react.

[Croghan27]

Sorry, I did not mean to say that Smiley's People ended the series .... it is only one incident in the journey. What it does do is show that the British resources, urged on by Lacon, are going into an aggressive retaliatory/clean up mode.

It is sometimes fun deciding who should play a character ..... Smiley is supposed to be a chubby appearing gentleman of (late middle age) uncertain years who cleans his glasses on the fat end of his tie and seems perpetually distracted.

Oh yes, Guinness was spectacular as GS, he made the part fit him. (Isn't than was great actors do?) The, available in YouTube, scene of someone saying: "George, we won." and the question of all the underhanded and underground work being called into question with Guinness responding, after a long pause, which for a less actor would be a killer;"Yes, I guess we did."

As Control I always see the American actor, Steven Hill, the one time District Attorney from Law and Order.

This series of stories about Fadden is .... unfolding. (Which is pissing me off.  )

Every day I find out something different that was said .... first I heard it was public servants, then that was modified to some elected officials, provincial and municipal. Just this AM I heard him non-retract the accusations (are they accusations) - affirm them.

Now he will reveal just what he meant (specifically) - but only to Teows and Co. - dropping a bomb then hiding behind ''the CSIS mandate'.

The main result of this drop a hint and then tantalizingly keep the pot boiling, "I know  a secret ... but if I tell you, I will have to kill you." scenario has been to keep him in the papers. The whole thing now seems like a reporters wet dream - spooks, politics, local involvement and a mystery which has crogh:" Muttering underneath his breath, Nothing is revealed".

I wonder if the PMO issued a acceptance and authorization for his revelations as required by all other public service employees?

[Toedancer]

I wonder if the PMO issued a acceptance and authorization for his revelations as required by all other public service employees?

Good question and if the (inside) answer is yes, then of course we'll never know. It does make you wonder if the PMO has a hate-on for a couple of centre left cabinet ministers.

[Holly Stick]

Brian Stewart has a good article about how politicians are given free trips by various countries and how this could be changed.
 
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/07/07/f-vp-stewart.html

[pogge]

Further evidence that Richard Fadden's foot is well acquainted with Richard Fadden's mouth:

Canada's spy chief identified a French hostage released in Mali as a "secret agent" even though the man steadfastly denied working for France's foreign intelligence service.

Canadian Security Intelligence Service director Dick Fadden's remarks to a gathering of military and security officials could raise new questions about his judgment following a firestorm of controversy surrounding his allegations of foreign influence over Canadian politicians.

Though he doesn't mention him by name, Fadden clearly refers to kidnapped aid worker Pierre Camatte during the speech to the Royal Canadian Military Institute.

[Toedancer]

CSIS has no right to detain, but it did. CSIS cannot conduct 'criminal' investigations EVER, but it did

Superior Court concluded has now written: "I am troubled by the atmosphere of coercion and intimidation that the CSIS   agents (and in particular Witness 'A') seem to have created and been   eager to embrace. The very people that are tasked by the federal   government to oversee and safeguard Canada's national security are   themselves acting in a manner that suggests either a complete lack of   comprehension of our Charter rights or else, they demonstrate a total   willingness to abrogate and violate these same principles. Neither is   acceptable and I find that the Charter breach in this case was serious."

[pogge]

I'd forgotten we had this thread. Yes, that was an interesting story -- it was reported in the media about ten days ago (with other articles in the Toronto Star and the Ottawa Citizen). CSIS forced their person of interest to cough up his hard drive by threatening to expose an extra-marital affair. The reporting I saw never did make it clear whether that affair was real or fabricated. And the way the hard drive was handed off from one person to another before charges were ever laid, there's simply no way to exclude the possibility that the images were planted.

Meanwhile, there have been developments in the story of Richard Fadden's claim that foreign governments were influencing Canadian politicians. The Toronto Star used an ATI request to obtain a copy of the memo Fadden eventually supplied to Vic Toews in which he named names. Of course their article doesn't report the names because they were redacted. And Toews' spokesthingy had no real comment on Toews' subsequent actions.

But the Star followed up and contacted the provinces for a reaction, paying particular attention to Ontario and BC:

The Ontario and British Columbia governments had no serious concerns   after being briefed by the Canadian spy agency about explosive   allegations that cabinet ministers were being clandestinely influenced   by foreign agents.

Quoth NDP public safety critic Don Davies:

It’s becoming a comedy of errors

ETA: I thought it already was.

[skdadl]

How charming the language that SIRC uses -- CSIS "strayed" from its mandate. *rolleyes* Gee, with oversight bodies like that, who needs enemies?

And in the second case, it is just as true: CSIS are not a police force. Nobody has to talk to them (or at least that's the law, not that CSIS much care about the law). If they come to your door, tell them to get off your property or you'll call the real police. (And then pray.) The law is supposed to work that way, but of course it doesn't.