Author Topic: Regime change in Egypt, too?  (Read 31826 times)

Toedancer

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2011, 02:37:41 PM »
Not Confirmed/Egypt President/son/family fled to the UK

Thanks skdadl for the explanation.

dB yes I know, I geddit.
"Democracy is not the law of the majority, it's the protection of the minority." -Albert Camus 1913-1960

Antonia

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #16 on: January 25, 2011, 03:22:42 PM »
Just FYI, follow #jan25 and/or #egypt
easier than following individuals
It is when we all play safe that we create a world of utmost insecurity. It is when we all play safe that fatality will lead us to our doom. It is in the "dark shade of courage" alone that the spell can be broken.
-- Dag Hammarskjöld

Toedancer

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"Democracy is not the law of the majority, it's the protection of the minority." -Albert Camus 1913-1960

deBeauxOs

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Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2011, 03:50:28 PM »
Just FYI, follow #jan25 and/or #egypt
easier than following individuals


My preference is to follow key individuals to avoid the traffic glut of multiple RT's.


Mother Jones piece about Egypt.

Antonia

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2011, 04:18:55 PM »
DBO, what's your handle on twitter?

eta: nebber mind. found it.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2011, 04:20:11 PM by Antonia »
It is when we all play safe that we create a world of utmost insecurity. It is when we all play safe that fatality will lead us to our doom. It is in the "dark shade of courage" alone that the spell can be broken.
-- Dag Hammarskjöld

skdadl

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2011, 05:21:28 PM »
Sorry for the slight diversion, but you don't get "traffic glut" by following a hashtag on Twitter. Traffic glut comes from following others; hashtags aren't what determines your feed, and you have to go to them to follow a sustained conversation. Your feed is determined by who you follow.

People have different theories about what Twitter is good for. WL, eg, follows nobody. Actually, I doubt that's true - I suspect they all have aliases, frequently changed, but they definitely know who to follow, and not just by hashtag. Ottawa journalists follow each other, kind of like Washington journos. You learn these things by watching their strange behaviour. Most of them still do not seem to get what social networking actually means.

deBeauxOs

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2011, 06:44:49 PM »
Traffic glut is how I choose to describe the MASSIVE number of MeToo! tweets and RT's that get all jammed in with those produced by credible sources.  It's what happens when a particular # goes viral or 'trending'.

That's why I prefer to follow specific individuals who offer the substance I want with links to pics, news items and articles.

It may not be the way to use Twitter if someone wants to surf a trend, but it works for me.

DBO, what's your handle on twitter? eta: nebber mind. found it.
:)) Hey! We had a little chat about my handle.   :p

skdadl

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #22 on: January 25, 2011, 07:01:47 PM »
Oh, well -- if you're following people who RT indiscriminately, then you should just unfollow those people, if your own feed is what you're thinking about.

lagatta

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #23 on: January 25, 2011, 07:11:24 PM »
It is important to think in depth and historically as well as following events closely. Please don't forget sources such as Le Monde diplomatique and Alternatives www.alternatives.ca

Et je vous en prie, no "unfollow". Newspeak is not a friend of critical thought.
" Eure \'Ordnung\' ist auf Sand gebaut. Die Revolution wird sich morgen schon \'rasselnd wieder in die Höhe richten\' und zu eurem Schrecken mit Posaunenklang verkünden: \'Ich war, ich bin, ich werde sein!\' "
Rosa Luxemburg

skdadl

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #24 on: January 25, 2011, 07:19:13 PM »
Well, I thought I was doing in-depth and moderately historical earlier, when I tried to discuss power relations involving Egypt.

It's great that so many ppl on Twitter are excited to think that Egypt could go the way of Tunisia (and we don't even know yet what that might be), but I'm pretty sure that simply will not happen in Egypt. The US and Israel will not allow it. I don't know whether that means they save Mubarak personally, but they certainly are not going to let the opposition take over there. They can't. That would be a war.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2011, 07:19:41 PM by skdadl »

lagatta

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #25 on: January 25, 2011, 08:03:01 PM »
You were thinking historically. But really, while twitter and co. are important news sources, it isn't all about them.

I don't have the time to follow tweets all day, so I prefer to read in-depth articles and follow news sources (alternative and the better bourgie ones, such as Grauniad and Libération) and keep up to date with comrades from a range of social movements in Tunisia. I don't know as many people in Egypt, or who have left it recently - I know several Egyptian Montrealers, but they left at least 20 years ago, if not a generation or two.

I was an active member of Le Centre d'études arabes pour le développement - one of the founding members of Alternatives - for many years. One of my regrets is that although I did take courses in Arabic - and gord did I love the calligraphy - I can't really read news articles, less still academic ones, in the language.

Very slight digression - young'uns, do study a major "non-Western" language when you are young and your brain is flexible, eh?
" Eure \'Ordnung\' ist auf Sand gebaut. Die Revolution wird sich morgen schon \'rasselnd wieder in die Höhe richten\' und zu eurem Schrecken mit Posaunenklang verkünden: \'Ich war, ich bin, ich werde sein!\' "
Rosa Luxemburg

deBeauxOs

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Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #26 on: January 25, 2011, 10:00:56 PM »
Oh, well -- if you're following people who RT indiscriminately, then you should just unfollow those people, if your own feed is what you're thinking about.

Funny, I actually said the opposite of that.
 
I follow people that come to my attention because their tweets contain observations that ring true or link to external material, documentation & sources that are solid and offer credible information.
 
I've observed that threads limited to trending #topics are mostly time-wasting traffic gluts, unless I'm trying to track back the origin of an interesting discussion that has been RT'ed by those I follow and trust.
 
ETA: original purpose - post links with important background information.
 
Ha'aretz.
 
CSM.
 
NPR.
 
RadioFreeEurope/RadioLiberty.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2011, 10:19:10 PM by deBeauxOs »

Toedancer

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"Democracy is not the law of the majority, it's the protection of the minority." -Albert Camus 1913-1960

deBeauxOs

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Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #28 on: January 25, 2011, 11:42:30 PM »
Article by Mona Eltahawy:
Quote
For years, Western observers of the Arab world have effectively helped shore up the dictators by stating as fact that Arabs don't revolt. Much to Egyptian pain and chagrin, analysts would point to our country, where protests have been the preserve of a small, dedicated but not always connected group of activists.

Mubarak, the longest-serving ruler in modern-day Egypt, would smartly give in to enough of workers' demands as necessary to appease; then his security forces would beat and detain the street activists who persevered.Whether tensions ran high over rigged elections, food shortages, Internet censoring, media repression or police brutality, the conventional wisdom has held that Mubarak would sleep without worry until thousands of Egyptians took to the streets.


Finally, on Tuesday, feet were on the ground. Thousands turned out in Cairo, Alexandria and across the country as the anti-government fervor fired up not just activists but families, too.Watching Tunisians make possible what Arabs have always been told was impossible burned away the apathy that bound Egyptians - and revealed decades' worth of smoldering rage.


And this.

skdadl

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Re: Regime change in Egypt, too?
« Reply #29 on: January 26, 2011, 02:47:51 PM »
So Clinton is getting scared.

This is the quote that matters, interpretation from Council on Foreign Relations:

Quote
Robert Danin of the Council on Foreign Relations think tank said Clinton's remarks for the first time appeared to make clear what the United States wants to see in Egypt: genuine change that originates from the government rather than a dramatic overthrow as occurred in Tunisia.

As the first Arab state to make peace with Israel, Egypt has much greater strategic importance to the United States than Tunisia. Egypt has long received major U.S. aid and supported Washington's efforts to promote a wider Arab-Israeli peace.

"This is not a walking away from the alliance with Egypt in any way but, at the same time, putting the Egyptian government on notice that changes are going to have to come pretty quickly," Danin said.

"It is trying to lay out a way there can be managed change if the regime is responsive to the people," he said. "It (the Obama administration) doesn't want to see the means adopted in Tunisia -- which would necessitate the leadership to flee."

The White House took a similar stance, making clear that it was monitoring events closely and that it fully supported the Egyptian people's right to peacefully protest.

"We are supportive of the universal rights of assembly (and) speech. ... We would stress quite clearly for all involved that expressions should be free from violence," White House spokesman Robert Gibbs told reporters aboard Air Force One.

"This is an important time for the government to demonstrate its responsibilities to the people of Egypt in recognizing those universal rights," Gibbs said.

Iow, they will stop any genuine revolution. The US and Israel will -- watch for statements from Israel.

ETA: Heh. Forgot I wasn't doing HTML.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2011, 02:50:00 PM by skdadl »

 

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