Author Topic: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions  (Read 13004 times)

Berlynn

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #30 on: March 13, 2011, 09:50:13 PM »
That's a good one.  Thanks Boom Boom!
Never retreat, never explain, never apologize--get the thing done and let them howl.  -- Nellie McClung

Boom Boom

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #31 on: March 13, 2011, 10:06:21 PM »
That's a good one.  Thanks Boom Boom!

I'm not sure being "boom boom" in a nuclear thread is a good idea! :p

Berlynn

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #32 on: March 13, 2011, 10:21:26 PM »

I'm not sure being "boom boom" in a nuclear thread is a good idea! :p

 :)) Better you with the nick, "Boom Boom," than the reactor going boom boom!

Here's the Sunday update from the independent, Union of Concerned Scientists.
Never retreat, never explain, never apologize--get the thing done and let them howl.  -- Nellie McClung

Mandos

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #33 on: March 13, 2011, 10:47:21 PM »
The anti-nuke argument kind of is a fear-based argument...

I mean, it's not that fear is unjustified, just that there's a relative ranking of fears, and nukes happen to rank lower on my list of fears than other things.  For Japan, aside from nuclear power, there is either coal, imported oil, or rather unpleasantly dramatic reductions in, um, energy use.

Croghan27

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #34 on: March 13, 2011, 11:53:06 PM »
The anti-nuke argument kind of is a fear-based argument...

I mean, it's not that fear is unjustified, just that there's a relative ranking of fears, and nukes happen to rank lower on my list of fears than other things.  For Japan, aside from nuclear power, there is either coal, imported oil, or rather unpleasantly dramatic reductions in, um, energy use.

Yes it is .... but fear is like Freud's sex or Jung's longing for some species present memory - it depends on how it is used. The conservative use of fear as a political ploy (watch out for them Islamos ... they may murder you in your bed) has given fear a bad name.
 
The scenario you describe is one to warm the cockles of a Koch heart. There are alternatives - reduction is just one of them. Co-generation is another: have a look at the furnaces of Mitsubishi Heavy Industries (who's maw I used to fill with iron ore), a terrific opportunity for co-generation. I dare not list all the possibilities as the brothers Koch and the brothers Hunt (now cousins) and all their ilk spend more money promoting their dirty possessions in a day than the entire green alternative spends in a year.
 
The sad part is that the so called 'green' alternatives have never been tried on all too many cases.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2011, 11:55:56 PM by Croghan27 »
"It is also a good rule not to put overmuch confidence in the observational results that are put forward until they are confirmed by theory." -- Arthur Stanley Eddington

Boom Boom

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #35 on: March 13, 2011, 11:57:10 PM »
Wasn't that reactor built on a known earthquake zone? :confused

Berlynn

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #36 on: March 14, 2011, 12:03:25 AM »
Yes, Boom Boom, I believe you're correct.  I read that at NIRS, perhaps.  Don't recall for sure right now.  Too tired and bug-eyed.

I don't buy the argument that nukes are the only way to go.  And that is not fear-based.  That is economically-based.  No nuke project can get off the ground without a government contributing tonnes and tonnes of money.  Not one nuke project is economically viable.  And bringing coal into the argument is obfuscating.

And now I've just discovered that some of the uranium used in Japan comes from -- you guessed it -- Saskatchewan!  Jesus fucking fuck! :mad2 :mad2 :blowup :panic :pout :pukey :mad2 :mad2
Never retreat, never explain, never apologize--get the thing done and let them howl.  -- Nellie McClung

Mandos

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #37 on: March 14, 2011, 01:14:58 AM »
What? Co-generation? That is a means of redistributing energy more efficiently, but...it's not some form of "alternative" energy in itself.  It still requires fuel.  So a country like, say, China is going to power itself using gas-fired co-generation plants?  That's...just a bunch of fossil fuel power plants. 

It's not a conspiracy.  It really is the case that renewables either really aren't (consider the outcry from activists opposing hydroelectric dam projects) or are not yet ready to supply the bulk of the power demanded/needed by large populations.   It also really is the case that coal is the major fuel temptation as it is extremely cheap and would offer many countries strategic energy independence for decades...
« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 02:30:59 AM by Mandos »

Mandos

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #38 on: March 14, 2011, 01:17:04 AM »
Quote
I don't buy the argument that nukes are the only way to go.  And that is not fear-based.  That is economically-based.  No nuke project can get off the ground without a government contributing tonnes and tonnes of money.  Not one nuke project is economically viable.  And bringing coal into the argument is obfuscating.

This is a very strange argument.  Lots of public works projects do not break even for a long time, and aren't expected to.  Privatization of those contributions is the problem, not the contributions in themselves.

Boom Boom

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #39 on: March 14, 2011, 08:39:29 AM »
Wasn't that reactor built on a known earthquake zone? :confused

The National last night had a piece by someone who said the nuke facility did everything that was expected of it and none of the buildings from the outside look damaged. The facility apparently was designed to survive a strong quake. If all that is true, however, then why is this a news story?  :confused

Boom Boom

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #40 on: March 14, 2011, 11:33:33 AM »
CBC reporting there was another explosion at the nuke plant this morning, but the Gov't is insisting no radioactivity was released.

Antonia

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #41 on: March 14, 2011, 10:41:57 PM »
Oh FCUK  :o

Quote
Japan faced the likelihood of a catastrophic nuclear accident Tuesday morning, as an explosion at the most crippled of three reactors at the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station damaged its crucial steel containment structure, emergency workers were withdrawn from the plant, and much larger emissions of radioactive materials appeared immiment, according to official statements and industry executives informed about the developments.         Japanese Prime Minsiter Naoto Kan made a televised address to the nation at 11 a.m. Tokyo time to discuss the latest developments in the crisis.

 :crying
It is when we all play safe that we create a world of utmost insecurity. It is when we all play safe that fatality will lead us to our doom. It is in the "dark shade of courage" alone that the spell can be broken.
-- Dag Hammarskjöld

Toedancer

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #42 on: March 14, 2011, 10:49:38 PM »
Oh fcuk yes a 3rd explosion

There is also a new fracture that alters everything. I don't think we've seen even the last mega disaster for poor Japan at all. NZ is in that ring of fire, so they are not finished either. The mind boggles, California next?
« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 11:03:01 PM by Toedancer »
"Democracy is not the law of the majority, it's the protection of the minority." -Albert Camus 1913-1960

Boom Boom

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #43 on: March 15, 2011, 10:33:19 AM »
A bunch of us on Facebook are suggesting we'd like to see Canadians open their homes to displaced Japanese (and Haitians), and the Canadian government grant access to Canadian medicare - for as long as necessary. This is a big country.

Mandos

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Re: Japan: huge earthquake, tsunamis, Asia-Pacific repercussions
« Reply #44 on: March 15, 2011, 02:08:50 PM »
From one of the biggest Peak Oil/ "energy realist" sites:

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/7661

 

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