Author Topic: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority  (Read 4427 times)

Mandos

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How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« on: April 19, 2011, 11:35:17 PM »
I realize that this very easy for me to say, as I myself won't be living in Canada again for a few years yet, at least.  But I've stopped worrying about the prospect of a Reformatory majority, in the sense that I've stopped worrying about something that is going to be inevitable sooner or later, and worse later than sooner, in my opinion.

There has been a Great Animus stalking the land, an Animus that has been pent-up for so long it has only gotten worse, if sneakier.  Sooner or later, the people who feed this Animus by believing in it are going to have to face the consequences of it, and tell the rest of us afterwards as we pick up the pieces whether they really enjoyed the ride.  Too bad they're going take a lot of people along with them...but there comes a point where it's time to stop shielding them from the consequences of what they believe.

That's why I wasn't opposed to having an election now, even with the risk of a Harper majority.  The longer this drags on, the bigger the Animus.  The Liberals aren't going to get any more popular in the Western part of the country, and there aren't enough Canadians lefter than Iggy to put the NDP in power any time soon.

If now is time to lance the abcess, so let it be lanced.

sparqui

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2011, 12:26:49 AM »
Worst case scenario is a Harper Majority. I don't know if I can live with such a festering boil.

The only hope I can see with a Harper minority is that his party turn on him hard and ruthlessly. I have no idea who would take over the helm but I would rejoice to see Harper drawn and quartered by his own.

Ignatieff is vile but not as heinous as Harper. If he gets a minority, I hope he is pounced on relentlessly and kept in control. And I am hoping that the LPC turn on him with a vengeance. And should the stars align to give Layton a minority of lead opposition, let's hope he finds his socialist values and sticks to them.
If my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a tractor. -- Gilles Duceppe

Mandos

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2011, 12:49:05 AM »
Well, that's the thing.  Y'all are going to have to face the festering boil in one form or another, because the Great Animus is not going away.

In the event of an unlikely Iggy minority or an even less likely Layton minority, what do you think will dissipate the Animus? That is the problem.

brebis noire

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2011, 07:46:42 AM »
Well, try to imagine yourself as a frustrated conservative, for whom the Festering Boil is the prospect of a coalition, more or less led by Ignatieff, but driven in purpose and spirit by Layton and Duceppe.  :p 

pogge

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2011, 09:07:31 AM »
There has been a Great Animus stalking the land, an Animus that has been pent-up for so long it has only gotten worse, if sneakier.  Sooner or later, the people who feed this Animus by believing in it are going to have to face the consequences of it, and tell the rest of us afterwards as we pick up the pieces whether they really enjoyed the ride.
I've already indicated somewhere around here that my expectations from this election are low. But "the people who feed this animus by believing in it" are nowhere near a majority -- the Animus isn't as Great as it may appear. It's artificially amplified by a few rich and powerful people who happen to control the newspapers and broadcast outlets and see it as a convenient cover that allows them to continue looting the economy. So it all seems so unnecessary.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2011, 09:09:18 AM by pogge »

Boom Boom

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2011, 09:10:39 AM »
Dark days ahead, whether Harper returns as PM in either a minority or majority. Ignatieff would only accept a call from the G-G to lead a coalition if his seat count is close to the Conservatives (308.com suggests the Cons will get 147 to the Liberals 80) like the Cons getting 125 and the Liberals getting 110 or so. In the interest of having a stable government and not forcing another election, Ignatieff is likely to support the Cons staying in power until the next mandated election unless something were to happen in the interim. So, the Cons get to run roughshod over the country for the next few years with Liberal support.

Mandos

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2011, 09:37:12 AM »
However many people it actually is, it doesn't matter.  The population of crazy in the USA is only about 33% at most.  That's more than enough to construct an Animus of that sort, if they're committed to crazy. 

In this case, yes, it has been stoked by rich people, by Conrad Black early on for one thing, but honestly, you can spend as much money as you want and still fail to convince people that the sky has polka-dots.  Good propaganda does one thing: it gives people an excuse to believe what they secretly always wanted to believe.  It is wish-fulfilment.

When Preston Manning came up with the slogan, "The West Wants In", which was a stroke of genius, he found the key to ignite a spirit already present and tame it to his ends, and until it has eaten its fill no one has so far yet found the dagger than can bleed it.

The rest is history.

Yes, this is pretty fatalistic, but it's the historical trend.  What animated Reform has not gone away because enough of the public identify with it at an emotional level and associate social democracy with the Liberal party be it fair or not.

Mandos

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2011, 10:01:48 AM »
Now the solution regardless of who gets elected, IMO, is a focus on provincial politics for the next four years or so and the reclamation of provincial legislatures, because it's clear that a lot of Canadians identify more with their provincial politics than their federal.  I didn't appreciate Canadian decentralisation in the past as much as I do now.

skdadl

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2011, 10:13:06 AM »
Maoist (ie, NAmerican Maoists, like the CPCML) logic used to run on the argument that things can only get better if they get worse first -- ie, that it takes a collapse before people wake up to the self-harm they've been doing themselves (politically, I mean, but yes, there's a psych theory in there too). I don't know that I've ever accepted that that is necessary or would necessarily work for literate countries with traditions of citizen empowerment, but it is always one alternative.

Some Americans I read or hear about are definitely desperate -- some areas of that country are already devastated economically beyond anything we face yet. But again, that leads first to populist reaction, and as we discussed a few days ago, populism can go either right or left -- see the Tea Party.

Maybe it's just the collection of people I know, but when I'm watching my Twitter feed scroll by, my antennae are telling me that Harper is going down. I don't watch network TV so maybe I'm missing what the mainstream is grokking, but I'm not scared yet.

Croghan27

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2011, 11:12:01 AM »
Quote
it's clear that a lot of Canadians identify more with their provincial politics than their federal.  I didn't appreciate Canadian decentralisation in the past as much as I do now.

I was at a Conservative function in Fredericton one time. (WTF - the beer was free) - 'Dicky' Hatfield was addressing the masses. He had just returned from the annual meeting between the Premiers of the Maritime provinces and the Governors of the New England states.
 
He pointed out that the state's governors salivated when they learned how much power and discretion the provinces have compared to them.
"It is also a good rule not to put overmuch confidence in the observational results that are put forward until they are confirmed by theory." -- Arthur Stanley Eddington

skdadl

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2011, 11:36:11 AM »
Would have been nice if forking Dalton McGuinty had used his forking constitutional powers to put the forking G20 where the mayor thought it should go. #punishmcguinty

Antonia

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2011, 07:41:18 PM »
I dunno Skdadl. If you're Twitter feed is like mine, then you follow mostly people who are on the same political wavelength as you are. I have blocked about 100 right-wing troll types, and I never see what they have to say. While I do pay attention to some rational conservatives, and there are some, I don't see this great swell you seem to see.

I think Mandos may be correct, despite the fact that a majority of Canadians will not vote for the CPC.
It is when we all play safe that we create a world of utmost insecurity. It is when we all play safe that fatality will lead us to our doom. It is in the "dark shade of courage" alone that the spell can be broken.
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skdadl

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2011, 09:08:32 PM »
I don't see a "swell" of support for anyone (although I read a lot of Liberals, many of whom annoy the hell out of me, and sometimes I troll them just b/c I've had enough of their cheerleading). But I do see an almost endless stream of documentation of Harper abuses. That's what has my antennae going. There's just so much dirt about Harper out there -- like, really a lot. I don't know how much of that is making it to the evening news shows, although most of the sources I see are msm.

@vickersty (sp?) agreed wi me on this point the other day. Anyone know who he is?

Antonia

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2011, 10:06:20 PM »
Quote
But I do see an almost endless stream of documentation of Harper abuses. That's what has my antennae going. There's just so much dirt about Harper out there -- like, really a lot. I don't know how much of that is making it to the evening news shows, although most of the sources I see are msm.

Quite a bit, actually. But that doesn't mean people are tuned in. Kirstie Alley squeezed into a size 10 yesterday, doncha know.

On another matter, I posted the latest emanation from the fetus fetishists in the Harper government on my FB page, and BQ MP Nicole Demers is in there swinging.  :applause

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/978054--pro-life-backers-shaped-tory-decision-to-defund-planned-parenthood?sms_ss=twitter&at_xt=4daf7591feb22e95%2C0
It is when we all play safe that we create a world of utmost insecurity. It is when we all play safe that fatality will lead us to our doom. It is in the "dark shade of courage" alone that the spell can be broken.
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arborman

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Re: How I learned to stop worrying and love the majority
« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2011, 01:27:36 PM »
Fighting a losing battle is still worth fighting, sometimes.  I will fight and vote against Harper as long as I am able, even knowing that he is likely to win again.  But I suspect Mandos is right - the worst are filled with passionate intensity.

Where he is wrong is in thinking that they will take responsibility for their beliefs when the shit hits the fan.  Once the Cons have been in power for 5 years, and the deficit is reaching epic proportions (due to rich tax cuts etc), health care is a shambles and all the rest - the crazy will find a way to blame the Liberals.  The thing about the crazy is that it is incapable of reason.

We don't have to look far for an example.  Bush left the US economy in an astonishing shambles (he wasn't alone, but he led the pack).  Obama, while a disappointment, is now seen by the crazy as wholly responsible for the problems.  A Tea Party president would not change that perception, no matter how bad it got.
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