Author Topic: Robert Fisk thread  (Read 18775 times)

Toedancer

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« Reply #15 on: December 01, 2006, 10:01:38 PM »
Quote
A large majority of Iraqis—71%—say they would like the Iraqi government to ask for U.S.-led forces to be withdrawn from Iraq within a year or less. Given four options, 37 percent take the position that they would like U.S.-led forces withdrawn “within six months,” while another 34 percent opt for “gradually withdraw[ing] U.S.-led forces according to a one-year timeline.” Twenty percent favor a two-year timeline and just 9 percent favor “only reduc[ing] U.S.-led forces as the security situation improves in Iraq.”


http://tinyurl.com/ozrjn  World Public Opinion dot org

And these people apparently having nothing to say about it!

According to Michael Moore, Monday was the day that counted up to all the days it took to defeat WW 2. And people can't even use the road to the Baghdad airport. That's pretty dismal.
"Democracy is not the law of the majority, it's the protection of the minority." -Albert Camus 1913-1960

Debra

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« Reply #16 on: December 11, 2006, 08:56:48 PM »
Lunch with Robert Fisk

10 minute video
“Damaged people are dangerous. They know they can survive.” —  Josephine Hart

skdadl

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« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2006, 06:50:31 AM »
Superb presentation. Everyone should watch and listen.

Debra

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« Reply #18 on: December 16, 2006, 07:38:10 PM »
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Oh how - when it comes to the realities of history - the Muslims of the Middle East exhaust my patience. After years of explaining to Arab friends that the Jewish Holocaust - the systematic, planned murder of six million Jews by the Nazis, is an indisputable fact - I am still met with a state of willing disbelief.

And now, this week, the preposterous President Mahmoud Ahmadinajad of Iran opens up his own country to obloquy and shame by holding a supposedly impartial "conference" on the Jewish Holocaust to repeat the lies of the racists who, if they did not direct their hatred towards Jews, would most assuredly turn venomously against those other Semites, the Arabs of the Middle East.

How, I always ask, can you expect the West to understand and accept the ethnic cleansing of 750,000 men, women and children from Palestine in 1948 when you will not try to comprehend the enormity done the Jews of Europe? And, here, of course, is the wretched irony of the whole affair. For what the Muslims of the Middle East should be doing is pointing out to the world that they were not responsible for the Jewish Holocaust, that, horrific and evil though it was, it is a shameful, outrageous injustice that they, the Palestinians, should suffer for something they had no part in and - even more disgusting - that they should be treated as if they have. But, no, Ahmadinajad has neither the brains nor the honesty to grasp this simple, vital equation.

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/fis ... 079304.ece
“Damaged people are dangerous. They know they can survive.” —  Josephine Hart

GDKitty

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« Reply #19 on: December 19, 2006, 08:26:27 AM »
Fisk is due to appear on "The Current" today (in a few minutes from now!). I will have to listen to the real-audio replay later today.

Croghan27

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« Reply #20 on: December 19, 2006, 10:53:01 AM »
I just heard the Current - what a civilized man.
"It is also a good rule not to put overmuch confidence in the observational results that are put forward until they are confirmed by theory." -- Arthur Stanley Eddington

Debra

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« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2007, 08:17:05 PM »
http://www.informationclearinghouse.inf ... e16086.htm

Quote
01/06/07 "The Independent" -- -- The lynching of Saddam Hussein - for that is what we are talking about - will turn out to be one of the determining moments in the whole shameful crusade upon which the West embarked in March of 2003. Only the president-governor George Bush and Lord Blair of Kut al-Amara could have devised a militia administration in Iraq so murderous and so immoral that the most ruthless mass murderer in the Middle East could end his days on the gallows as a figure of nobility, scalding his hooded killers for their lack of manhood and - in his last seconds - reminding the thug who told him to "go to hell" that the hell was now Iraq.

"Nothing in his life became him like the leaving it," Malcolm reported of the execution of the treacherous Thane of Cawdor in Macbeth. Or, as a good friend of mine in Ballymena said to me on the phone a few hours later, "The whole bloody thing was obscene." Quite so. On this occasion, I'll go along with the voice of Protestant Ulster.
“Damaged people are dangerous. They know they can survive.” —  Josephine Hart

GDKitty

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« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2007, 01:32:12 AM »
"Iraqi insurgents offer peace in return for US concessions"
Quote
For the first time, one of Iraq's principal insurgent groups has set out the terms of a ceasefire that would allow American and British forces to leave the country they invaded almost four years ago.

The present terms would be impossible for any US administration to meet - but the words of Abu Salih Al-Jeelani, one of the military leaders of the Sunni Iraqi Islamic Resistance Movement show that the groups which have taken more than 3,000 American lives are actively discussing the opening of contacts with the occupation army.
[...] Then come the conditions:

* The release of 5,000 detainees held in Iraqi prisons as "proof of goodwill".

* Recognition "of the legitimacy of the resistance and the legitimacy of its role in representing the will of the Iraqi people".

* An internationally guaranteed timetable for all agreements.

* The negotiations to take place in public.

* The resistance "must be represented by a committee comprising the representatives of all the jihadist brigades".

* The US to be represented by its ambassador in Iraq and the most senior commander.

[...] Indeed, the insurgent leader specifically calls for the "dissolution of the present government and the revoking of the spurious elections and the constitution..."

He also insists that all agreements previously entered into by Iraqi authorities or US forces should be declared null and void.

Agreements? I wonder if they're thinking of the Petroleum Law. Just pulling that one out of my hat. :roll:

sparqui

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« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2007, 04:50:30 PM »
I think there were also some juicy low-to-no tax incentives for foreign investors plus zilch restrictions on foreign investment.
If my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a tractor. -- Gilles Duceppe

Debra

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« Reply #24 on: February 21, 2007, 08:18:09 PM »
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How easily the sparks from the American-Israeli fire fall across the Middle East. Every threat, every intransigence uttered in Washington and Tehran now burns a little bit more of Lebanon. It is not by chance that the UN forces in the south of the country now face growing suspicion among the Shia Muslims who live there. It is no coincidence that Israel thunders that the Hizbollah are now more powerful than they were before last year's July war. It is not an accident that Sayed Hassan Nasrallah, Hizbollah's leader, says he has brought more missiles into Lebanon.

Why, the Lebanese ask, did President Bashar al-Assad of Syria visit President Ahmadinejad of Iran last weekend? To further seal their "brotherly" relations? Or to plan a new war with Israel in Lebanon?

The images of Iran's new missile launches during three days of military manoeuvres - apparently long-range rockets which could be fired at US warships in the Gulf - were splashed across the Beirut papers yesterday morning, along with Washington's latest threats of air strikes against Iran's military. Be certain that the Lebanese will be the first to suffer.

For the West, the crisis in Lebanon - where Hizbollah and its allies are still demanding the resignation of Fouad Siniora's government - is getting more serious by the hour. Up to 20,000 UN troops - including Nato battalions of Spanish, French and Italian forces - are now billeted across the hillsides of southern Lebanon, in the very battleground upon which the Israelis and the Hizbollah are threatening to fight each other again.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.inf ... e17140.htm
“Damaged people are dangerous. They know they can survive.” —  Josephine Hart

skdadl

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« Reply #25 on: February 22, 2007, 06:29:57 AM »
It's a real worry. The Americans are driving this confrontation, and I still think they will make direct attacks on Iran, but the rest of the region will start to blow up too, in just this way.

What is it about Dick Cheney? He wants everyone else to die before he does?

Debra

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« Reply #26 on: March 03, 2007, 08:37:16 PM »
Quote
How easy it is to put hatred on a map

Our guilt in this sectarian game is obvious. We want to divide our potential enemies

By Robert Fisk

03/03/07 "The Independent" - -- -- Why are we trying to divide up the peoples of the Middle East? Why are we trying to chop them up, make them different, remind them - constantly, insidiously, viciously, cruelly - of their divisions, of their suspicions, of their capacity for mutual hatred? Is this just our casual racism? Or is there something darker in our Western souls?

Take the maps. Am I the only one sickened by our journalistic propensity to publish sectarian maps of the Middle East? You know what I mean. We are now all familiar with the colour-coded map of Iraq. Shias at the bottom (of course), Sunnis in their middle "triangle" - actually, it's more like an octagon (even a pentagon) - and the Kurds in the north.

Or the map of Lebanon, where I live. Shias at the bottom (of course), Druze further north, Sunnis in Sidon and on the coastal strip south of Beirut, Shias in the southern suburbs of the capital, Sunnis and Christians in the city, Christian Maronites further north, Sunnis in Tripoli, more Shias to the east. How we love these maps. Hatred made easy.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.inf ... e17230.htm
“Damaged people are dangerous. They know they can survive.” —  Josephine Hart

Toedancer

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« Reply #27 on: March 03, 2007, 08:43:06 PM »
We are all sickened now what/
"Democracy is not the law of the majority, it's the protection of the minority." -Albert Camus 1913-1960

sparqui

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« Reply #28 on: March 03, 2007, 09:43:28 PM »
He is so bloody right:

Quote
Why are we trying to divide up the peoples of the Middle East? Why are we trying to chop them up, make them different, remind them - constantly, insidiously, viciously, cruelly - of their divisions, of their suspicions, of their capacity for mutual hatred? Is this just our casual racism? Or is there something darker in our Western souls?

Take the maps. Am I the only one sickened by our journalistic propensity to publish sectarian maps of the Middle East? You know what I mean. We are now all familiar with the colour-coded map of Iraq. Shias at the bottom (of course), Sunnis in their middle "triangle" - actually, it's more like an octagon (even a pentagon) - and the Kurds in the north.


It was weird to read the above right after hearing about this on the news this evening:

Quote
Iranian president, Saudi king pledge to fight Muslim sectarian strife in Mideast
DONNA ABU-NASR, Associated Press Writer

March 3, 2007 6:12 PM

RIYADH, Saudi Arabia (AP) - Following their first official talks in Saudi Arabia, the Iranian and Saudi leaders on Saturday pledged to fight the spread of sectarian strife in the Middle East, which they said was the biggest danger facing the region.

Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and King Abdullah also stressed the importance of maintaining Palestinian unity and bringing security to Iraq, the official Saudi Press Agency said.

The agency quoted Ahmadinejad as saying he supported Saudi efforts to calm the situation in Lebanon and end its political crisis. Iran supports Lebanon's Shiite Hezbollah group, which is trying to topple the U.S.- and Saudi-backed government.

The talks between the two leaders have been touted as a possible means to defuse sectarian tensions in Iraq and Lebanon, and prevent Iran from sliding further into isolation.

''The two leaders asserted that the greatest danger threatening the Muslim nation at the present time is the attempt to spread strife between Sunni and Shiite Muslims and that efforts should be exerted to stop such attempts and close ranks,'' the Saudi Press Agency said...


http://www.newspress.com/Top/Article/ar ... 2763210139

Another new entry from Fisk:

Robert Fisk on Bin Laden at 50

The most wanted man on the planet was 36 when our veteran correspondent met him for the first time in the desert


By Robert Fisk, Middle East Correspondent
Published: 04 March 2007

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/fis ... 326225.ece
If my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a tractor. -- Gilles Duceppe

Debra

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« Reply #29 on: March 30, 2007, 07:45:54 PM »
http://www.informationclearinghouse.inf ... e17448.htm
Quote
Robert Fisk on Shakespeare and war

Shakespeare could have been writing about Iraq or Afghanistan, his scenes of battle were so prescient. Robert Fisk dissects the Bard's attitude to conflict - and describes how relevant he has found it to be today

By Robert Fisk

03/30/07 "The Independent" -- -- Poor old Bardolph. The common soldier, the Poor Bloody Infantry, the GI Joe of Agincourt, survives Henry IV, only to end up on the end of a rope after he's avoided filling up the breach at Harfleur with his corpse. Henry V is his undoing - in every sense of the word - when he robs a French church. He must be executed, hanged, "pour encourager les autres". "Bardolph," laments his friend Pistol to Fluellen, "a soldier firm and sound of heart, /...hanged must a' be /A damned death!

"Let gallows gape for dog, let man go free, / And let not hemp his wind-pipe suffocate: / But Exeter hath given the doom of death... / Therefore go speak, the duke will hear thy voice; / And let not Bardolph's vital thread be cut... / Speak, captain, for his life..."

How many such military executions have been recorded in the past 30 years of Middle East history? For theft, for murder, for desertion, for treachery, for a momentary lapse of discipline. Captain Fluellen pleads the profoundly ugly Bardolph's cause - not with great enthusiasm, it has to be said - to Henry himself.

"I / think the duke hath lost never a man, but one that / is like to be executed for robbing a church, one / Bardolph, if your majesty know the man: his face is / all bubukles and whelks, and knobs, and flames o' / fire, and his lips blow at his nose..."

But the priggish Henry, a friend of Bardolph in his princely, drinking days (shades of another, later Prince Harry), will have none of it:

"We would have all such offenders so cut off: and we / give express charge that in our marches through the / country there be nothing compelled from the / villages; nothing taken but paid for; none of the / French upbraided or abused in disdainful language..."

In France, Eisenhower shot post-D-Day rapists in the US army. The SS hanged their deserters even as Berlin fell. I have my notes of a meeting with Fathi Daoud Mouffak, one of Saddam Hussein's military cameramen during the eight-year Iran-Iraq war, a sensitive man, a mere Pistol in the great retreat around Basra where a reservist was accused of desertion by an officer of the Iraqi "Popular Army". He was a very young man, Mouffak was to recall:

"And the reporter from Jumhuriya newspaper tried to save him. He said to the commander: 'This is an Iraqi citizen. He should not die.' But the commander said: 'This is none of your business - stay out of this.' And so it was the young man's fate to be shot by a firing squad... before he was executed, he said he was the father of four children. And he begged to live. 'Who will look after my wife and my children?' he asked. 'I am a Muslim. Please think of Allah - for Saddam, for God, please help me... I am not a conscript, I am a reservist. I did not run away from the battle - my battalion was destroyed.' But the commander shot him personally - in the head and in the chest."
“Damaged people are dangerous. They know they can survive.” —  Josephine Hart

 

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